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A New Defense

 
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Abbo55



Joined: 01 Jan 2006
Posts: 114
Location: Middle Of Nowhere, West Kansas

PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 11:32 pm    Post subject: A New Defense Reply with quote

Has anybody ever tried to run the 3-5-3? I think it's a pretty balanced defense because of the speed thats on the field. I like to have my OLBs to act like 3-4 OLBs. I also like I just like the Inside guys to be fast enough to cover the WRs. One more thing is I like to have 3 DTs instead of one with two ends. They need to plug up the whole line to let the LBs run. Here's what it would look like on Madden:
Code:

..........S..........
.....................
.....................
.....................
........I.M.I..........
......O.......O.......
C.......E.N.E.........C

The ILB are MLB2 and MLB3. If you have better personnel to fill those spots, go ahead.

Here's my base play out of the 3-5-3:
Line-base
Mike-Hook Zone
Inside- Man Coverage- I like the faster guys to cover the better recievers, so that's how i set that up.
Outside-Base
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pimpdaddypat



Joined: 03 May 2004
Posts: 268

PostPosted: Tue Mar 14, 2006 10:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ive run a 3-5-3 alot. it works best against single-back formations but also does well against other balanced formations. however, i prefer to have my corners back deep and have my outside linebackers to be wide enough and fast enough (almost like strong safeties) to cover the flats or the outside run. consider it.
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Abbo55



Joined: 01 Jan 2006
Posts: 114
Location: Middle Of Nowhere, West Kansas

PostPosted: Wed Mar 15, 2006 1:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I will. Thanks for the suggestion!
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All Star



Joined: 23 Jan 2005
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Sun Mar 19, 2006 1:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Until I got Madden 06 Sad with no playbooks usable I used to run a very sucessful 3-5 defense, based on having linebackers all over the field to chase down the running back, a three deep zone, and having multiple LBers blitzing to create pressure, but it kinda looked like this:

Code:
..........S..........
.....................
.....................
.....................
C......I..I..I......C
....O...........O....
........E.N.E........


The DEs could be shifted out another square but it isn't important. My main difference here is I spread it out a bit more, moving the CBs a couple squares back to avoid being burnt. My base zone play would have one of the 5 linebackers blitz, the DBs cover deep, and the two outermost non blitzing linebackers would do a hook/corner zone thing, while the two remaining inside guys would run a hook zone.

My BEST blitz play would have the left three linebackers blitz, the safety deep zone, and everyone else man. Which would have the three lineman blitz, along with the three left most LBers overloading the O-Line completley while leaving sufficient coverage accross the rest of the field.

Ehh, just my $0.02........

I actually had a playbook with 14 completely different formations based on the personel.... heh, i loved doing that, but now I can't........
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pimpdaddypat



Joined: 03 May 2004
Posts: 268

PostPosted: Sun Mar 19, 2006 5:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

that's more like what i run ... it allows for criss-crossing of linebackers and d-line to create confusion and hopefully break some pressure into the backfield, while maintaining coverage down the field ... with this defense you dont have to have 6 down linemen or blitz 8 people just to get pressure ... you can do it blitizing only 4 or 5 people ... you just have to cause confusion by running a wide range of blitz combinations ... and you are still able to cover the pass ... but i would mainly reccomend it against single-back formations
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Abbo55



Joined: 01 Jan 2006
Posts: 114
Location: Middle Of Nowhere, West Kansas

PostPosted: Sun Mar 19, 2006 9:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do you guys think it would work in the NFL? If it works so well against Singleback formations, and most NFL teams run SB as their base package, then I think it would work based on what I've seen. I've also watched Southern Illinois Univerisity 3-5-3 cutups, and based on what they did, I think it would work.
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Arkaein



Joined: 30 Sep 2003
Posts: 333

PostPosted: Sun Mar 19, 2006 9:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think it could be effective in real life, but I'm not sure it would be practical as a base defense.

First of all I don't think single back is the base offense for many NFL teams, although most teams will use a fair amount of single back sets. Another problem is personnel. Most teams don't have 5 decent LBs, and any team that acquired that many would probably have reduced depth and either D-line or DB, which would make the defense slightly more vulnerable to power running teams or four WR sets, if not both.

This kind of defense might also have problems with players like Antonio Gates or Brian Westbrook, players which often demand some DB coverage because most LBs can't keep up with them.

I don't think these deficiencies are huge killers though, and the formation has potential to do some of the same sort of things that 3-4 defenses do, including my Peregrine 3-4.

Looking at the two 3-5-3's presented here I think I like the look of All Star's a bit better. Abbo, the tight coverage by your CBs just leaves some dangerous looking voids deep down the sides. With All Star's version the CB cushion should prevent getting burned too easily while the LBs are spread a bit more to help cover hooks and slants. I'm not sure about All Star's blitz play though, as I'm not much a fan of either 6 man blitzes or Cover 1 coverages. The base play described sounds pretty good though.
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Abbo55



Joined: 01 Jan 2006
Posts: 114
Location: Middle Of Nowhere, West Kansas

PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2006 12:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think any 3-4 team could run this. I mean, they have to have 1 good backup linebacker somewhere on the roster. It actually has worked for many college & HS teams, and I think its only a matter of time until and NFL team tries it.

I think I'll move my CBs back a little and see what happens. I have a good article on the founders of this defense, Georgia Military College. If anyone wants it, post your email.
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pimpdaddypat



Joined: 03 May 2004
Posts: 268

PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2006 3:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

you don't have to have 5 linebackers, the two farthest out "linebackers" could be more like strong safeties if need be ... at least one of them ... like a John Lynch
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Abbo55



Joined: 01 Jan 2006
Posts: 114
Location: Middle Of Nowhere, West Kansas

PostPosted: Tue Mar 21, 2006 6:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think I'll modify mine to look exactly like the one Georgia Military College runs. I have their 2005 playbook, so I should get some good information. I'll let you know if it works as good for me as for them!
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skee420



Joined: 29 Mar 2005
Posts: 22

PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 3:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

pimpdaddypat wrote:
you don't have to have 5 linebackers, the two farthest out "linebackers" could be more like strong safeties if need be ... at least one of them ... like a John Lynch


I agree, this is one of my staple strategies since I started creating defenses. Sticking a hard hitting safety into a 4 or 5 linebacker formation is tough and versatile. I think the Redskins should be doing something like this with their newly acquired Adam Archuleta.

Also, for those playing with only 3 (or less) guys on your D-line take a look at picking up a standout player right on the line, rather than just all top linebackers. A 3-4 or 3-5-3 with a standout DE really works well because he can create havoc by himself or create just enough mayhem for the linebacking corps to do what is expected of a 3-4 or 3-5-3.
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All Star



Joined: 23 Jan 2005
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Sat May 06, 2006 10:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I actually would go more with John Abraham type DE's in the two OLB spots for me, with cover LBers up the middle, with so many LBers on the field they do not need to go sideline to sideline so speed is not important, though on passing downs it would make sense though to add an extra couple of DBs.
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Phate



Joined: 16 Dec 2003
Posts: 83
Location: Washington State

PostPosted: Mon Jul 31, 2006 11:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Arkaein wrote:
I think it could be effective in real life, but I'm not sure it would be practical as a base defense.

First of all I don't think single back is the base offense for many NFL teams, although most teams will use a fair amount of single back sets. Another problem is personnel. Most teams don't have 5 decent LBs, and any team that acquired that many would probably have reduced depth and either D-line or DB, which would make the defense slightly more vulnerable to power running teams or four WR sets, if not both.

This kind of defense might also have problems with players like Antonio Gates or Brian Westbrook, players which often demand some DB coverage because most LBs can't keep up with them.


Our school runs this defense and I absolutely hate it. You're pretty much limited to either going man on man or cover three deep with the OLBs taking the flats, then calling either 6,5, or 4 man blitzes while the nonblitzing LBs and DL go hook zone.

That's what we do, anyway, and it absolutely kills us when the other team discovers the middle is completely vulnerable to a quick pass. *Sigh* What a horrible defense. Just stick to a 5-2 or 4-3 or 4-4. That's my best advice
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